New to spanners TJ Build

[V]

I have LHD V8 ZJ steering mounted upside down, reamed over the knuckle (OTK) on my RHD. I didn't know there was a kit now - cool!

 

The JKS links have ball joints which can accommodate a bent axle bracket on the steering damper side. An alternative is to extend the brackets by welding new brackets to them (same size both sides) lifting the JKS pins higher or using a narrow canister damper. I have raised brackets on one XJ and bent brackets and slim OEM damper on the other.

 

The easiest way to bend your original sway bar axle brackets is to forget to disconnect the JKS links when driving off road. They will bend, but it is a bit hit or miss if they bend into a convenient position. Better to heat the difficult bracket with a gas torch, bend with a short scaffold pipe or big pipe wrench then quench with water from a hose pipe.

 

If using a gas torch, jack the front end up, remove the wheel and the JKS mounting pin. Be mindful that your plastic high pressure fuel line is just above and behind where you are applying the heat. Take adequate safety precautions. Substitute a sacrificial nut and bolt of a similar size to the JKS pin mount to get the direction of the bend right without damaging the JKS pin. Refit the JKS pin when the bracket is bent enough. Aim for just enough clearance for an easy fitment. If too much, you risk binding the ball joint on street driving.

[UKTJ]

Hot on the heals of my steering upgrade came a suspension lift.  I wanted to try and avoid driveline vibrations associated with larger lifts on TJs.  To address this you need to either drop the transmission mount with spacers, which to some extent rather negates the benefit of the lift.  To avoid this you need to fit a slip yoke eliminator and double cardon driveshaft, at which point costs start to mount up.  I'm not saying I will never fit an SYE and DC driveshaft, just that I didn't want to have to at this stage as I would rather use the money for regearing.  This limited me to about 2 1/2" of suspension lift, which is fine because in combination with the 1" body lift already fitted it just about gets me into 33" territory, anything bigger takes you into a world of financial pain.

 

Aiming for 2 1/2" I looked at spring options and decided to go with Old Man Emu.  There are a number of different options for springs with different free lengths and spring rates.  The internet can provide a number of evenings of confusing and sometimes contradictory reading on the topic of spring configuration.  The biggest problem with all this is being able to get an accurate understanding of the sprung weight of each corner of the Jeep being lifted, as only then can you use the free lengths and spring rates to work out what height the Jeep will sit at.  As I plan to add a winch to my Jeep I went with the 933 front spring which is designated as Heavy Duty with the same spring rate but about 1/2" longer free length than the light duty.  At the rear I went with the 941 light duty spring, this is longer but with a lower spring rate than the heavy duty spring, however, over any reasonable range of sprung weights the lift provided is very little different.  I bought the springs from www.4x4works.co.uk, whilst I am happy to buy from the US if it saves me money it seems ARB products are generally no cheaper once shipping and tax are included.

 

A lot of what I read online suggested that OME had changed the nitrocharger shock often pared with their springs a few years back.  The newer sport version was considered much stiffer and pretty harsh on road.  The best online reviews for reasonbly priced shocks (ie not going up to Fox 2.0s and similar) pointed me in the direction of either Rancho 5000x or SkyJacker Blackmax.  At the time I ordered Quadratec had a deal on the Blackmax, so that is what I went with.

 

Once everything arrived (well, in truth, actually some considerably time after it arrived) I got started.  But of course, getting started was a frustration as it just involved a couple of days spraying things with penetrating oil.  But eventually I got the blocks, jacks and stands out and really got started.

 

Penetrating oil or not, getting the front shocks out was not fun and I had to resort to some pretty brutal techniques.

 

But eventually I did get them out.  Once the shocks were out, with the sway bar disconnected it was quite easy to get the original springs out, just jack up one side of the axle and remove the spring from the drooped side.

 

With the new shocks in my mind turned to bump stops.  I wanted to ensure that if the suspension was fully exploited it was the bump stops that were the limiting factor, not the shocks or any interference.  I jacked up one axle to the point where the shock was within about 1/2" of its 13 1/2" fully compressed position.

 

I then measured where the cup of the bumpstop was relative to the spring perch.

 

 

I should have taken the jounce bumpers out before doing this, but at the time I was worried they would break before coming out (as it happened I had to take them out later to get the new springs in).  I check full lock both way with the axle in this position and there was no interference, I also measured for wheel clearance with a bigger tyre (though I knew I will should repeat this exercise once the bigger tyres were fitted,  the prospect of pulling the new springs is not one I relish).  Taking these measurements it meant with 1/2" of shock travel left I had an inch before I bottomed out on the perch, so a 1" bumpstop extension would be enough to give me a 1/2" safety margin.  On a US site I had found a good option for bump stop extensions in 1" multiples, frequently used, is ice hockey pucks.  This is what I used, I drilled the pucks with a recess for the bolt head and then took on a task I had not been looking forward to.  For the best results the extension needs to be fitted to the spring perch, this means drilling and tapping a hole for the bolt.  This is the first time I every tapped a hole, there was limited access and I only really had one chance.  Mercifully it went fine, but was too stressful for me to consider taking pictures during the process.  With the hole tested I did not fit the puck as...

 

...I then needed to fit the new springs, even with no puck, the jounce bumper removed and lots of effort I could not do this without the use of the dreaded spring compressor.  But I managed to use it without any mishaps.

 

 

Once the spring was seated I could slip the puck in and bolt it into the newly drilled and tapped hole.  I could then refit the new shock and the front was done.

 

The rear followed a similar pattern and it seems I have lost the few pictures that I did take.  The upper rear shock mount bolts are a bit notorius for being a problem to remove, but I was lucky and had no issue.  The bump stop extensionsa re also easier as it is OK to simply fit these under the existing bumpstop with a longer bolt.

 

And she was done and looking a bit taller.

 

 

Edited June 10, 2022 by UKTJ

[V]

I think the damping rates are partially influenced by geography. American roads are very different to ours and they often pick damping rates that are a bit squishy in the UK. I will be going firmer on my next set of Bilsteins.

 

Keep an eye on the settlement of your rear springs, especially after driving off road. It is not unusual in the UK for non heavy duty springs to sag on lifted TJs that are loaded with either rear seat passengers or camping gear. I have seen a fair few kits do this on UK TJs. Come to think of it, I'm pretty sure I had to 'shim' the coils on my TJ's Skyjacker kit more than once with OME spring isolators and poly spacers.

[V]

I have some unused 10mm OME TJ isolators in my storage somewhere (bright yellow urethane). If I find them before summer camp you can have them.

 

Your TJ is looking great. I bet you won't be letting a tyre shop do your tracking again now you've done it yourself.

[UKTJ]

On 10/06/2022 at 18:52, V said:

I think the damping rates are partially influenced by geography. American roads are very different to ours and they often pick damping rates that are a bit squishy in the UK. I will be going firmer on my next set of Bilsteins.

 

Keep an eye on the settlement of your rear springs, especially after driving off road. It is not unusual in the UK for non heavy duty springs to sag on lifted TJs that are loaded with either rear seat passengers or camping gear. I have seen a fair few kits do this on UK TJs. Come to think of it, I'm pretty sure I had to 'shim' the coils on my TJ's Skyjacker kit more than once with OME spring isolators and poly spacers.

 

Apologies V, I thought i had replied before, but it seems I imagined it.

 

Agreed, the old jokes about sportier American cars only being any good in a straight line as they wallowed so much in the corners had more than a grain of truth.  But, so far based on only a limited number of miles, I am very happy with the BlackMax shock absorbers and I do not find them overly compliant.

 

I will keep an eye on the rear.  The interesting thing for me is that, as I think I mentioned above, there really is not a massive difference between the quoted lift from the OME light and heavy duty rear colis in a reasonable range of sprung weights.  The light duty 941 has a free length of 15.53" and a spring rate of 140lbs. The heavy duty 942 has a free length of 14.96" and a spring rate of 160lbs. Based on those figures with an sprung load per rear spring of 650lbs each spring yields a compressed spring height of:
941 = 10.89"
942 = 10.90"
Increase that load per spring to 750lbs and you get:
941 = 10.17"
942 = 10.27"
Increase that load per spring even more to 850lbs and you get:
941 = 9.46"
942 = 9.65"
Indeed, if you want to get to a 1/2" difference in the springs the load needs to be at 1200lbs per spring:
941 = 6.96"
942 = 7.46"
At which point the Jeep is lower than stock.

That does not take account of what happens to the springs over time once installed, and the light duty ones may well be more prone to sagging.  Whilst I did have two rear seat passengers yesterday when I went to SpeedFest, that is likely to be a very rare scenario, so rare that I am thinking of removing my rear seat.  Though part of the reason for that removal will be to allow more carrying capacity on trips such as the JOC Summer Camp.  I will keep an eye on it, if they do sag I can replace them with the heavy duty springs, the cost of the springs is, in the scheme of things, a small part of the cost of lifting the TJ.

 

On 10/06/2022 at 19:15, V said:

I have some unused 10mm OME TJ isolators in my storage somewhere (bright yellow urethane). If I find them before summer camp you can have them.

 

Your TJ is looking great. I bet you won't be letting a tyre shop do your tracking again now you've done it yourself.

 

One of the things I meant to add in my update, but forgot, was about spacers/ isolators.  I know the OME kits tend to come with these, but typically I think it is the front ones that people use as I believe a lot of people need to use these to reduce the amount of rake, which is frequently exaggerated versus the stock rake.  I did not fit any for a couple of reasons.  As fitted when I cycled the suspension it looked like the springs were giving me enough clearance for the tyres I planned to add.  I still needed to add a few things to get to the longer term position, the larger spare is on the back, but I have yet to fit the upgraded hinge assembly, I have still not fitted my winch to the winch plate and I want to add some rocker protection / sliders.  Once all of that is added I will know what I am likely to want / need.  That said and even without those considerations, I currently have not caused any vibration in the driveline, so if I can squeeze another little bit of it without doing so I would probably do that.

 

If you do have any of the bright yellow OME isolations that I can use to trim out the lift they would be very much appreciated.  Thanks for the kind offer.

[UKTJ]

And just to complete the picture on this thread, I now have the 285/75/16 Falcon Wildpeak MT01s fitted.  I have also replaced the spare carrier with an uprated, stronger one from Rugged Ridge, but still need to fitted the uprated hinge assembly - just as soon as I can get the Torx bolts in the hinges loose 

[doodle]

4 minutes ago, UKTJ said:

And just to complete the picture on this thread, I now have the 285/75/16 Falcon Wildpeak MT01s fitted.  I have also replaced the spare carrier with an uprated, stronger one from Rugged Ridge, but still need to fitted the uprated hinge assembly - just as soon as I can get the Torx bolts in the hinges loose 

Heat, just a little, and a little bit more!

 

[UKTJ]

I have yet to take on the tailgate hinges again, but as a little light relief on Sunday I fitted my winch.  My wife is delighted as it had been on our bedroom floor since my birthday   Nothing lots of others haven't done before, but a few quick pictures.

 

I needed to remove the winch plate to attach the winch to it, this revealed the elongated bolt holes in the winch plate are resulting in a lot of trapped mud, I will need to keep an eye on this.

 

The bolts feed from under the winch plate and fix to square nuts that you drop into slots that hold them captive.

 

Before reattaching the winch plate with the winch fixed to it I fitted the solenoid above the drum.  The instructions included with the winch are a bit out of date here, they describe having to bolt some sort of clamp to the solenoid, whereas all that actually needs to happen is to screw it down into pre-tapped holes on the top of the winch bars.

 

The instructions for the wiring are excellent though, and everything is helpfully colour coded.

I then rested the winch plate on the bumper so I could route the cable to the negative battery terminal and connect to the winch, finally before reattaching the winch plate I rounted the cable to the positive battery terminal. Then I remounted the winch plate.  All the wiring was a bit of a squeeze betwen the back of the winch and the grill.

 

With my wife sitting in the Jeep lightly pushing the brake pedal down I spooled the cable on, using my pick-up as an anchor.  I even managed to get the cover on.

 

Another item from the parts stock finally fitted!  Though I do need to fit an isolator as soon as I can.

[V]

16 hours ago, UKTJ said:

I needed to remove the winch plate to attach the winch to it, this revealed the elongated bolt holes in the winch plate are resulting in a lot of trapped mud, I will need to keep an eye on this.

Fill the cavities with silicone sealant.

 

16 hours ago, UKTJ said:

All the wiring was a bit of a squeeze betwen the back of the winch and the grill.

The high current power cabling will get hot under load. If any of the cabling is resting on any edge of the sheet metal bodywork the cable insulation will melt like butter. This will lead to a big spark and possibly fire. It is best to sleeve all of your winch cabling in convoluted plastic tube trunking. I use the slitted style. If you don't want to do that, sleeving the cable at the bodywork contact points in old radiator hose cable tied securely will do. The Wrangler grille slots are notorious for sparking unprotected cables.

 

Have you got an isolator switch in the positive feed cable between the battery and the solenoid (close to the battery)? If not, install a minimum 200Amp continuous (500A+ intermittent) switch. Its a safety feature but also stops miscreants damaging your Jeep if the switch is locked away. I use a race car battery cut off switch under the bonnet of my XJ. A marine switch would be better, I just didn't have space and the race car switch was a lot cheaper.

 

If your cables are tight and you really need longer cables or some extra cables, let me know what you need. I can give you a quote for made up leads. I make my own cable sets using good quality copper cable and nickel plated copper tube terminals, crimped with hexagonal dies and sleeved with heat shrunk tubing.

 

[digger]

HiUktj, 

Your tj is looking really good now! Well done! Do you still want me to write up my regear for you? I have started but its a long job.

Some good advice from V above.

 

[UKTJ]

13 hours ago, digger said:

HiUktj, 

Your tj is looking really good now! Well done! Do you still want me to write up my regear for you? I have started but its a long job.

Some good advice from V above.

 

Hi @digger Whilst I would love to think I could take on a regear I don't have the work space, tools and (most importantly) skills to take that task on.  So I would be really interested in your regear, but it is something I know I will have to pay a garage to do for me.  Hopefully it is all going as planned.

[V]

For someone that is 'new to spanners' you have done really well and achieved impressive results with your TJ modifications on your own. You have a lot to be proud of.

[digger]

Ok uktj, I made a lot of notes re regear etc and will continue to finish it. I also think you have done very well and the ' skills ' needed are more a matter of knowing what to do and how to use the tools . I think with a bit of help from us when wanted and a bit of swatting you would  surprise your self.

[digger]

UKTJ. Re Workspace.

I think as long as you can park the car and jack stand each end one at a time you could do it if you were just changing the cogs, car up /axle down for room to work.  I did the front this way as there was no need to remove the axle from the car.  My rear was a bit more awkward as I had to take the axle out, weld up the new one etc. A bench some where is helpful. Its best to keep wind blown dirt away if you don't have a garage, perhaps by wrapping a tarp around it all or something.

 

Just fitted my new front prop. Wait for loctite to cure and traffic to die down ,then its out for a test run, fingers xd!

[V]

When I was young lad, I would volunteer at work to deliver components to a specialist process provider on a Friday afternoon. Most of my colleagues hated doing this as it meant a late arrival back at the factory. However, with the factory gates locked I couldn't return the van to it's parking place and the deal was usually to bring it back on Monday. This meant that I had an empty transit van for the weekend. I built quite a few car and motorcycle engines in the back of the firm's Transit on a Black & Decker workmate.

[digger]

Absolutely brilliant V!  What a gr8 idea! Amazing what can be done on a workmate! 

 

I can't beat that but this might give you a laugh.  I have been on the fix lying in the snow , I've pulled engines out with rope pulleys slung over a tree branch and made a new head gasket for a biker on the side of the road from a fag packet I found in the ditch!!  Those were the days! Oh what fun!!!  Too much moaning now! LOL

 

Prop excellent! No vibes at all now! Very good and reasonable priced service from Bailey and Morris , Feltham. They retubed (with increase diameter stronger tube) it, balanced it, fitted my already bought new Spicers, painted it and got it back in time! All for £ 108 + and postage. Looking forward to the ''Jungle''

[jerryg]

2 hours ago, V said:

When I was young lad, I would volunteer at work to deliver components to a specialist process provider on a Friday afternoon. Most of my colleagues hated doing this as it meant a late arrival back at the factory. However, with the factory gates locked I couldn't return the van to it's parking place and the deal was usually to bring it back on Monday. This meant that I had an empty transit van for the weekend. I built quite a few car and motorcycle engines in the back of the firm's Transit on a Black & Decker workmate.

So now the challenge - list as many things you can think of to do with or on a Workmate. Keep it clean!!

[UKTJ]

On 21/06/2022 at 15:58, V said:

...The high current power cabling will get hot under load. If any of the cabling is resting on any edge of the sheet metal bodywork the cable insulation will melt like butter. This will lead to a big spark and possibly fire. It is best to sleeve all of your winch cabling in convoluted plastic tube trunking. I use the slitted style. If you don't want to do that, sleeving the cable at the bodywork contact points in old radiator hose cable tied securely will do. The Wrangler grille slots are notorious for sparking unprotected cables...

Quick question for the clooective JOC wisdom.  According to Winchmax my winch to battery cables are 35mm2 and checking online it says a 35mm2 cable is 11.6mm diameter.  I am looking to buy some of the pretective tubing and wondered how much bigger it needs to be than the cable it is going over?  I see a 13mm option, 15mm option, 18mm option...  Any thoughts?

[V]

The convoluted tubing I used on my winch power cables is 16mm internal diameter and 21mm external diameter.

 

Cut a strip of plain paper about 3" x 1/2". Wrap it around the winch power lead so that it forms an overlapping spiral. Draw a line on the paper that crosses the overlap and is at a right angle to the long edge of the paper. Unwrap the piece of paper and measure in mm the distance between the lines. Divide the measurement by 3.142 and you have the diameter of your power cable.

Edited July 1, 2022 by V

[digger]

Good dodge that one!   Pi does come in handy!

[TimC]

21 minutes ago, digger said:

Good dodge that one!   Pi does come in handy!

Mmmmmm……Pi

[UKTJ]

19 hours ago, V said:

The convoluted tubing I used on my winch power cables is 16mm internal diameter and 21mm external diameter.

 

Cut a strip of plain paper about 3" x 1/2". Wrap it around the winch power lead so that it forms an overlapping spiral. Draw a line on the paper that crosses the overlap and is at a right angle to the long edge of the paper. Unwrap the piece of paper and measure in mm the distance between the lines. Divide the measurement by 3.142 and you have the diameter of your power cable.

OK, sounds like 15mm IN sleeve will be fine. Thanks.

[UKTJ]

My TJ made it through its first MOT post lift, new steering, etc. today.  Happy about that.  Needed a couple of things sorted and my wife, on autopilot told the local garage to go ahead and do them.  With my new spanner proficiency I could have done at least one of them for a fraction of the cost, but hey ho, the big thing is it passed!

Edited September 14, 2022 by UKTJ

[UKTJ]

For Christmas I was fortunate to receive an ARB compressor, it is the middle one so it can run both air to tyres and lockers which will hopefully be fitted in the near future.  I'm hoping to be able to fit the compressor in the next few days but I wanted to get thoughts on the best location.

 

There is an empty tray on the drivers side of the engine compartment just in front of the fire wall (where the battery would be on a LHD).  This seems to be a very popular mounting position.  However, having just read the long list of suggested considerations for the mounting position in the ARB instructions I have a couple of questions.

 

The instructions say the mounting location should be "...above the highest possible waterline to avoid sumerging during water crossings..." and "...position must allow free flow of dry, cool air to the filter assembly (unless an intake extension tube is to be used...".  What I now wonder is whether the requirement to be above the waterline is only to ensure the dry air flow or is there a wider issue with avoiding water getting into the pump itself other than through the air intake?  I have seen Jeeps where differential breathers are run to the top of a snorkel to match the air intake for the engine and I wonder if this is an option with the air pump.  Otherwise mounting on the tray mentioned above (which positions the pump below the stock air intake) will permanently reduce wading capability and make a snorkel pointless.  Does anyone have an ARB compressor installed in a position where it will occassionally be fully submerged?  And if so has it caused any issues?

 

If the pump itself can't get wet, then it would seem the best thing to do would be to mount it inside the Jeep and get used to any noise.  This would certainly help tick some of the other boxes in the ARB list of considerations, such as trying to get the compressor halfway between the axles in a dual locker install.  However, I am then unsure of how the airlines would be run from inside the Jeep.  Has anyone done or seen an install inside where the compressor is used for lockers?  And if so, how were the airlines run?

 

Many thanks in advance for any input.

[V]

My electric compressor is mounted inside my XJ in the right hand rear side panel. Next time I will be sacrificing the air conditioning to change the AC compressor into an air-compressor.