Do you drive an unmodified or road-biased Jeep?

[V]

I am interested in how well served entry level off-road Jeep enthusiasts are in the UK. How big of a community your fellow jeepers are? What your opinion is on how the non-Wrangler Jeepers are doing in the UK. If you drive a 21st century Jeep (Patriot, Compass, Renegade, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, Commander, Avenger), this post is for you. It doesn't matter if your Jeep is a 22 year old high mileage auction bargain or a brand new model, I'm interested in what you have to say.

 

There's a poll about off-road use that you should be able to answer all responses that you think are relevant to you.

Edited July 3 by V

[Caroline12]

Hi Vince,

as you know I use my Jeep Renegade 2016 Trailhawk off road as much as I can, she is great fun to drive and has a lot of off road ability. she is fantastic on Green lanes. 

my bright yellow Daisy is leading a group around Cranbourne Chase/Wiltshire hills, Salisbury to Shaftesbury. Stopped for a spot of lunch. 
behind me is @Raakhee with an un-modified Wrangler, @MGomeswith his modified wrangler and @spookie the aardvark with his 2002 modified Grand Cherokee. 

Edited July 4 by Caroline12
Added info

[Raakhee]

When I had my 2WD Renegade Longitude I was enthusiastic to go to JOC days. Modded that one and took it to Parkwood 4x4.

 

 

Afterwards I upgraded to a Renegade Trailhawk because I wanted 4x4 to continue attending JOC days. 1 year later I upgraded the tyres to BF Goodrich KO2s and swapped the springs for 1.5 inch lifting springs. That's as modified as I went as it was also my daily drive.

 

 

@MGomes, @spookie the aardvark,  @Caroline12 and I became fast friends and we continued to go exploring Salisbury and Wiltshire. 

Final upgrade to a Rubicon was a childhood dream realised. I have many ideas on modifications however for now, she remains stock. She also is my daily drive and I have to say,a trip to the supermarket each week is so worth the envious looks. 

 

 

I have also had many people talk to me about my Jeep and what we as JOC do. Always have great pleasure in showing them photos and relating stories. No other vehicle has really brought me so much joy.

[MGomes]

1 hour ago, Raakhee said:

When I had my 2WD Renegade Longitude I was enthusiastic to go to JOC days. Modded that one and took it to Parkwood 4x4.

 

 

Afterwards I upgraded to a Renegade Trailhawk because I wanted 4x4 to continue attending JOC days. 1 year later I upgraded the tyres to BF Goodrich KO2s and swapped the springs for 1.5 inch lifting springs. That's as modified as I went as it was also my daily drive.

 

 

@MGomes, @spookie the aardvark,  @Caroline12 and I became fast friends and we continued to go exploring Salisbury and Wiltshire. 

Final upgrade to a Rubicon was a childhood dream realised. I have many ideas on modifications however for now, she remains stock. She also is my daily drive and I have to say,a trip to the supermarket each week is so worth the envious looks. 

 

 

I have also had many people talk to me about my Jeep and what we as JOC do. Always have great pleasure in showing them photos and relating stories. No other vehicle has really brought me so much joy.

Shame that picture does not have the sound effects

[MGomes]

4 hours ago, Caroline12 said:

Hi Vince,

as you know I use my Jeep Renegade 2016 Trailhawk off road as much as I can, she is great fun to drive and has a lot of off road ability. she is fantastic on Green lanes. 

my bright yellow Daisy is leading a group around Cranbourne Chase/Wiltshire hills, Salisbury to Shaftesbury. Stopped for a spot of lunch. 
behind me is @Raakhee with an un-modified Wrangler, @MGomeswith his modified wrangler and @spookie the aardvark with his 2002 modified Grand Cherokee. 

I don't think we can call Daisy "entry level"- I have seen her going places

[Caroline12]

7 minutes ago, MGomes said:

I don't think we can call Daisy "entry level"- I have seen her going places

She is, smallest and cheapest Jeep in the range and an excellent first time off-roader, Daisy is just adventurous in heels  

[Overlander21]

4 hours ago, Raakhee said:

 

 

That's a cracking photo

 

[Fireman Iain]

I'm more than happy to use my WK2 on greenlanes and club events. But it's my daily, so I've got to use some sensible restraint. 

 

Only experience of pay and play in it lasted about 20 mins. Too many idiots trying to smash their beaten Pajeros or Discos up, and I didn't want to become collateral damage. 

 

My limited experience of club days is totally different. I'm really looking forward to Tong later this month, and hopefully Walters Arena in September.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MGomes]

4 minutes ago, Fireman Iain said:

I'm more than happy to use my WK2 on greenlanes and club events. But it's my daily, so I've got to use some sensible restraint. 

 

Only experience of pay and play in it lasted about 20 mins. Too many idiots trying to smash their beaten Pajeros or Discos up, and I didn't want to become collateral damage. 

 

My limited experience of club days is totally different. I'm really looking forward to Tong later this month, and hopefully Walters Arena in September.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You have hit the nail when it comes top&p sites - I will only visit these on JOC events (Modified Jeeps is the exception now) - as the drivers tend to be more sensible, pick your crown and stick with the ones that want to explore the car but respect the car. Like you my car is my daily drive so I am careful with it

[V]

16 minutes ago, Fireman Iain said:

Only experience of pay and play in it lasted about 20 mins. Too many idiots trying to smash their beaten Pajeros or Discos up, and I didn't want to become collateral damage.

I've had the same experience but I made it through the whole day thinking it was just unusual. I went a second time to another pay and play site and the same thing happened. That was over twenty years ago and I've not done one since.

[Raakhee]

On 04/07/2023 at 13:54, Overlander21 said:

 

That's a cracking photo

 

The video has me screaming 

[MynameisCarlos]

Hi Vince,

 

My 1st JOC show was Slindon 2022 and I was very surprised to see the number of Wranglers/rubicon attending and the low number of other Jeep models, now, after attending 9 different JOC events this sea of Wranglers don t surprise me much, how Simon Miskelly mentioned once, will be nice to see other jeep models during these events, I grow up in a country (Venezuela) that have so many off-roading resources, where you every weekend can just take your 4x4 and go offroading as you like, and if you plan ahead you can go to the Amazons or other places to explore/camping etc....we don t have 4x4 pay and play sites, all of that makes the Jeep brand a very lucrative business over there, their main competitor is Toyota, I lived in Venezuela 27 years and can t recall seeing any land rover on road or off-road over there, same with brands like Jaguar, BMW and Mercedes Benz, Venezuela is a very American business with a love for offroading.  

 

Saying that the rule pretty much over there is to get a Jeep and do the Mods as you wish, rather than just pay for a Wrangler ready to rock...something like Caroline amazingly is doing with Daisy for example,  if you check Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeep_venezuela/?hl=es    you will see how is the opposite, you will find more variety of models rather than just wranglers. 

 

Yes, the car market is different in the UK and if I go to pay for something to go offroading I prefer to pay for a Wrangler that includes all of the toys and is ready to go snow/sand/mud/rock also the main factor is that the Petrol in Venezuela is very cheap, I would normally pay for 60 gallons here £100 (I only use Vpower Shell) so let s say £80 full tank using normal petrol, in Venezuela for the same amount will be about £9 max, that s why we have a very large amount of Jeep Grand Cherokees for example, you can do the modifications that you want and still use it as you daily drive because the petrol is so cheap, is no need to buy a wrangler to go off-roading. 

 

My 1st Jeep was a Cherokee classic 2001, which I used during my time at University, by that time there were no phones with cameras or even digital cameras so the only pic I can find is a scanned photo of the day I got the car...

 

And the second pic is my current Cherokee, a picture that took Simon,  still lots of mods to do, to then be able to assist in more JOC events, I don t have the mechanical knowledge that some other members have and had done great stuff with their jeeps (no Wranglers) yours for example but I will continue learning and improving. 

 

[V]

Thank you all for your comments and for your poll responses. This is really interesting and I hope that more will respond so that the poll is more representative of the non-Wrangler, and unmodified Wrangler community.

[Tony-U]

Just spotted this on one of my occasional visits to this forum (yes... I'm still here, but life in general and moving house has gotten in the way of things over the last 18 months or so!).

 

Anyway, I consider my Renegade 75th 2.0 4x4 diesel to be unmodified in most respects (other than over-size 225/60R18 Yokohama Geolandar A/T tyres), and I really enjoy recreational green lane off-roading (byways, UCRs etc). Nothing too hard core, but now I live in the North Cotswold/South Warwickshire area, I have some decent lanes (and fords) on my doorstep.

 

I have been stockpiling items for a subtle modification project on my Jeep. Now I'm settled, hopefully it will be getting a 1.5" lift, new Trailhawk 17" wheels, Falken Wildpeak tyres, Eibach spacers, a Trailhawk rear inner bumper w/recovery hook, Rigid ditch lights and Mopar side skirts all fitted in the next couple of months. The fridge and camping/cooking rig are already fitted :-)

 

Pay & play events don't really appeal to me, but I really would welcome some organised Jeep (Renegade)-specific green laning days which are not too hard core, and say a max of 4 or 5 vehicle...

 

I have voted in your poll!

 

Cheers - Tony.

[UKTJ]

17 hours ago, Tony-U said:

Just spotted this on one of my occasional visits to this forum (yes... I'm still here, but life in general and moving house has gotten in the way of things over the last 18 months or so!).

 

Anyway, I consider my Renegade 75th 2.0 4x4 diesel to be unmodified in most respects (other than over-size 225/60R18 Yokohama Geolandar A/T tyres), and I really enjoy recreational green lane off-roading (byways, UCRs etc). Nothing too hard core, but now I live in the North Cotswold/South Warwickshire area, I have some decent lanes (and fords) on my doorstep.

 

I have been stockpiling items for a subtle modification project on my Jeep. Now I'm settled, hopefully it will be getting a 1.5" lift, new Trailhawk 17" wheels, Falken Wildpeak tyres, Eibach spacers, a Trailhawk rear inner bumper w/recovery hook, Rigid ditch lights and Mopar side skirts all fitted in the next couple of months. The fridge and camping/cooking rig are already fitted

 

Pay & play events don't really appeal to me, but I really would welcome some organised Jeep (Renegade)-specific green laning days which are not too hard core, and say a max of 4 or 5 vehicle...

 

I have voted in your poll!

 

Cheers - Tony.

I think you will be very happy with the Wildpeaks, they are working really well for me.  I guess I am half way between the two camps, I have a Wrangler but at 20+ years old it came with none of the bells and whistles of a more recent model - I do not believe the ‘03-‘06 TJ Rubicon was sold in RHD.  Fitting a lift to allow bigger tyres and get more ground clearance has been a game changer for me, so I am sure you will be very happy with that too.

 

IMHO there is a lot to be said for a lighter and more nimble vehicle off-road.  That said the four door Wranglers with electric everything, roof tents, etc. are very nice and no doubt a lot more pleasant to drive 3 hours to an event in and camp with overnight.

[Stew the Jeep]

On the subject of pnps from experience I only do organised owners club events

[V]

It is interesting that the 'On green laning trips that I organise myself' has 5 responses so far. For those that checked that box, would you be interested in organising green laning trips either as a Member Organised Event or to volunteer leading one at a JOC event?

 

If not, what barriers stand in your way from doing so?

What would you need to overcome them?

 

[Stu2985]

I have led Green lane trips on behalf of JOC summer camps several times and enjoyed it.

I also lead green lane trips for small group of friends or when I decide it suits me.

My free time and recreational fuel budget is less than it used to be so I have to choose wisely who and how I spend it with.

 

I am reluctant to  lead groups  for commercial purposes where I get paid or the organisation I am leading them for are making money from it.  I did a green lane leaders course a couple of years ago where the issue of  liability really opened my eyes and scared hell out of me.  I found previously that I would  get people who have never laned before  being handed over to me and  take them out.   I dont know enough of the newer jeeps and their 4x4 systems to give advice on when to press what.  Also Jeeps are getting wider now and more modded which in my opinion can get a novice and even experienced laners into even more trouble and difficulty.  Last thing I want to do is take someone with a nice vehicle  somewhere they could scratch or damamge it.  Disclaimers are not the legal umbrella that you may think they are.  Also there is the assumption on behalf of some folks that as the leader you are responsible for fixing their breakdowns or getting them back home.  Although will do everything I can I am not a mechanic.  I know people say well its my own fault if I drive into a tree and dent my bodywork but its nto something to reply on nowadays.  Likewise a lane can become overgrown over a few weeks and turn into a scratchy lane where I remember it as a nice open lane.    So sadly I pick and choose my trips now Vince.

[TimC]

Very, very similar to my own position Stu.

[Mike WK2]

Good question, for me i have no issue with being the person at the front doing the map reading, showing the route etc. My only caveat to that is I still haven’t found what is the best app for planning and navigating trips in the UK as yet, and seems like you need two separate systems. ( I do need to spend more time looking at this - so suggestions welcome )  

 

What I wouldn’t be to comfortable with is taking on the liability of others. Happy to share thoughts advice etc, but don’t want to be hung for it latter

[TimC]

Mind you, my position here isn’t really valid, I’m not in the target demographic for this poll, it’s much more aimed at you Mike. My vote for this poll probably isn’t really relevant  either and probably skews the polling a bit. My vote was “never” since I am never planning on taking the Renegade or the Compass off road……..I have enough modified/off road biased Jeeps for that.

[MGomes]

24 minutes ago, Mike WK2 said:

Good question, for me i have no issue with being the person at the front doing the map reading, showing the route etc. My only caveat to that is I still haven’t found what is the best app for planning and navigating trips in the UK as yet, and seems like you need two separate systems. ( I do need to spend more time looking at this - so suggestions welcome )  

 

What I wouldn’t be to comfortable with is taking on the liability of others. Happy to share thoughts advice etc, but don’t want to be hung for it latter

 

I have led a few trips with the JOC, quite a few with a close group of friends (mostly on the Salisbury plain) and led last week one of the green lane groups on the Jeeps in the Jungle 2 (you are right, always tricky with people that you do not know well, but I am still to meet a bad Jeeper  ). I personally (my personal choice)use OS Maps, I actually pay for the annual subscription (Allow you to plan routes in advance and save them, usually plan them on my desktop and then use my iPad on the car, I have a RAM mount solution that works perfectly with the Wrangler JL, so even without a co-pilot I manage OK alone (Willow is really smart, but sits in the back and does not read maps lol)

[Mike WK2]

Oh, and the last piece of the puzzle is confidence in the platform. I have lots of experience in solid axles ( all be it along time ago ) but still getting use to wheels lifting so easily, and picking better lines for IFS.

[slammedeluxe]

I have had two Jeep Renegade 2.0 Limited 4x4’s, the 2015 was my first step into Jeep ownership and at the time I was doing 18k miles a year and it enabled me to properly discover what Jeep ownership was about and introduced me to JOC and Slindon off road days back in 2017 which I attended with the encouragement of a good friend. 
 

The 2015 had a number of additions but remained mechanically stock and I had some great days out with JOC and sis some green Laning too.

 

I traded the 2015 for a 2018 Limited as I was  still doing high mileage and couldn’t afford a Trailhawk but the Renegade Limited has allowed me to still actively participate, friends have quickly tagged along and bought their own Jeeps on the back of JOC days we have attended together. 
 

With a change of job circumstances and now doing very low miles, whilst I couldn’t afford to change the Renegade for a JKU, I did have the funds to modify the 2018 Limited to improve some of the immediate limitations of the smaller Uni-body Renegade, mainly ground clearance so on a budget, I now have a 1 1/2” suspension lift, Trailhawk 17” wheels, bigger Falken Wildpeak AT3W 225/65/17 All Terrain tyres, Terrafirma wheel spacers, Mopar Steel Sill Protectors Rigid A Pillar Pod Lights and Rigid 40” Roof Light Bar, Roof Basket, Awning, Roof Top Tent, Auxbeam Pod Control system and I have a long list of ‘wants’ to continue building the Jeep up as finances allow. 
 

Now I wouldn’t say that I needed any of the modifications to still have a great day Green Laning or with JOC and the stock size Yokohama Geolander GO15 All Terrain Tyres that I was running before the suspension install etc we’re more than capable performance wise but, Indo feel I have a bit more ability/confidence and I love the look of the build as it slowly comes together. 
 

JOC has always been very welcoming, it’s what I really love about the club.

 

The ‘non-wrangler’ owners groups that I have experienced are pretty thin on the ground though the Renegade pages do seem to be pretty active, however, I don’t envy JOC trying to organise events etc as my experience of trying to do the same for Renegades, despite a few thousand registered members on pages etc, is whatever you organise is never on everyone’s door step or at the end of the road and it ends up being a very select few that are willing to travel any distance to participate in anything which can be exceedingly frustrating, however, but still we try! 
 

 

 

 

 

[V]

3 hours ago, slammedeluxe said:

whatever you organise is never on everyone’s door step or at the end of the road and it ends up being a very select few that are willing to travel any distance to participate in anything which can be exceedingly frustrating, however, but still we try!

The longest distance I have travelled to an off road event so far is around 5,500 miles. With 2,200 miles of that driven in my Jeep. Once, you have driven more than 700 miles in one journey, your perception of the size of the UK shrinks. For me, the UK is now a small Island that you can get to anywhere and back again in a car within 24 hours (hmm... perhaps not an EV).

 

The mileage on my Jeep doesn't bother me, but the cost of fuel for the time spent does. I haven't really thought about it until now but I guess everybody has a sweet spot for the ideal balance between cost and fun. I have been estimating the value for money on my fun for years. I will travel longer distances to spend more time Jeeping and shorter distances for shorter duration events.

 

The last event I went to in Wales incurred a 6 hour journey from home. I spent £100 entry + £300 on fuel for a 5-day event. Some of the days were longer than others but if I take an average of 8 hours Jeeping per day that's 40 hours of Jeeping. £400 / 40 hours = £10 per hour. Obviously, that's just entry cost and fuel. It doesn't factor in maintenance, wear & tear, insurance, tax etc.

 

In comparison, a one day event that would cost £50 entry + £200 in fuel for 6 hours Jeeping is £42 per hour. If the same event was over two days, entry £90 + £230 fuel, for 12 hours of fun it drops to £27 per hour.

 

I am on a four day coast to coast Northern England expedition next week and I have a 5 hour journey to get to the start. I expect my total spend will be £100 camping + £300 fuel with 10 hours maximum driving per day. The cost of fun for the expedition is £10 per hour.

 

As an event organiser, having good data helps a lot, but not always. My coast-to-coast expedition is going ahead next week with two drivers, perhaps three subject to Jeep repairs. It's bang on my personal price point but there are other factors that have put off people from going. Running it on weekdays to avoid other green laners, and on a week before school summer holidays start requires more time off work and holiday allowance to be used.

 

"If you build it, they will come" often doesn't apply when it comes to Jeep events. You have to do quite a bit of work on the demographics to achieve success or be really lucky.