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5 tyre rotation


KelvinJ

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Hi folks,

 

Just a quick question, does anyone have any experience with 5 tyre rotation & if wheel alignment/tracking is required afterwards?

 

Correctly or incorrect I would understand that each individually balanced & that therefore the wheels themselves are running true

 

As a side note:

 

1) I am considering using Copper grease spray as an anti seize for the wheel nuts?

2) Does anybody use locking nuts?

 

Comments?

 

Many thanks in advanced,

 

KelvinJ

Over the Pond in the UK

2013 Wrangler JK 2.8L Auto Sahara

AT Tuff MODS

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Hi Kelvin,

 

Used to many years ago always do 5 wheel rotations. Nowadays I just do 4 wheel back to front, fronts to back every 5 or 7K and the wear and tear stays nice and even.

 

I would just watch the tread depth and avoid too much of a variance (rotate early and often) especially on the fronts.

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Awesome thanks Jim - will do  :great:

 

Where do you buy yours tyres?

 

I'm running LT305/55R20

IMG_6237.thumb.JPG.b793cbc043d9148b64863f5945837739.JPG

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Greg at Tyres direct. Just got a set of KO2's for my Cherokee, and Toyo Open Country MT's for my Rubicon.

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Greg at Tyres direct. Just got a set of KO2's for my Cherokee, and Toyo Open Country MT's for my Rubicon.

 

Toyo Open Country MTs - the king of off-road tyres (apparently) - I'm guessing you went for the 295/70/17 size Jim? ... being a LCOG chap ...

 

Wish they would make these in 35" (or even 37") for Europe :grrrrrr:

... still if BFG made the KO2 in 37"  :icon_bounce:

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Bingo. Couldn't get replacement BFG KM2's in 285/70/17 here

 

AEV guys in Moab said they can't get their hands on Toyo Open Country MTs in the states anymore. Low and behold Greg at Tyres Direct said "hey, I can get 295/70/17's in the Toyo's

 

I have to say even though they weigh 12 pounds more per tire than BFG KM2's (that's a lot of sidewall protection) the ride quality is outstanding. Softer compound so very sticky on wet and dry tarmac and out at Salisbury Plains they churned the mud nicely. One odd characteristic, the KM2's were noisy up to 20 mph then quieted. Toyo' do the opposite. Having said that, I would go with them next time too.

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cameronw2411

Would definitely recommend Toyo Open Country to anyone wanting to swap tyres.

 

I've run them on my TJ for many miles now and can't complain, far superior in the wet compared to KM2's which I had on before.

 

So impressed with them and the value for money that we've got another 5 in the garage waiting to be put on the JK.

 

IMG_1579_zpszvmtuowd.jpg

 

 

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I do a 5 tyre rotation on my JK, aim to do it every 5k. I do this for a number of reasons, but please correct me if my logic is incorrect.

 

1. The obvious need to rotate tyres.

2. Mileage, this means for every 25k driven the tyres have actually done 20k, as each tyre will have spent 5k as a spare.

3. Rolling radius, by bringing the spare into the rotation the rolling radius of all tyres will be as close as possible. Hence as small a difference as poss should I need to change one due to tyre damage.

 

Last but I think most important,

 

4. I spent my money on a matched set of 5 rims and tyres, so I am going to use the lot rather than have one sat looking nice on the tailgate and never get used.

 

Would be interested in options to replace my 315/70r17's Wrangler duratrac  :scratch:

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I do a 5 tyre rotation on my JK, aim to do it every 5k. I do this for a number of reasons, but please correct me if my logic is incorrect.

 

1. The obvious need to rotate tyres.

2. Mileage, this means for every 25k driven the tyres have actually done 20k, as each tyre will have spent 5k as a spare.

3. Rolling radius, by bringing the spare into the rotation the rolling radius of all tyres will be as close as possible. Hence as small a difference as poss should I need to change one due to tyre damage.

 

Last but I think most important,

 

4. I spent my money on a matched set of 5 rims and tyres, so I am going to use the lot rather than have one sat looking nice on the tailgate and never get used.

 

Would be interested in options to replace my 315/70r17's Wrangler duratrac  :scratch:

 

Neal, I bought a set of the "new" BFG KO2 All-Terrain for my other 4x4. I can only tell you that, when the KM's on the Rubi are due for a replacement I will be putting these on!

 

I drove them in snow, sand and garvel and they are really good! That said, in the UK you are likely looking into a Mud rather then AT.

 

Keep us posted

Hugo

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I do a 5 tyre rotation on my JK, aim to do it every 5k. I do this for a number of reasons, but please correct me if my logic is incorrect.

 

1. The obvious need to rotate tyres.

2. Mileage, this means for every 25k driven the tyres have actually done 20k, as each tyre will have spent 5k as a spare.

3. Rolling radius, by bringing the spare into the rotation the rolling radius of all tyres will be as close as possible. Hence as small a difference as poss should I need to change one due to tyre damage.

 

Last but I think most important,

 

4. I spent my money on a matched set of 5 rims and tyres, so I am going to use the lot rather than have one sat looking nice on the tailgate and never get used.

 

Would be interested in options to replace my 315/70r17's Wrangler duratrac  :scratch:

 

Echoing (mostly) what Hugo said ... go for the BFG KO2 - it is available in the UK in the size you want and is a fantastic "AT hybrid" tyre ... cross between AT and MT ... but with a compound that means it functions really well as a daily driver. Highly recommended :great:

 

As to "tyre rotation" - I understand all the points you (and many others) have made about the commonsense of getting the most even use out of your 5 tyres - however, when I had a Defender90 for 10 years, I never rotated once.

An "old hand" at the garage I used for servicing explained that tyres get used to doing a particular job - the fronts turn, the rears do not AND the spare is there "just incase". He also said if I was getting uneven wear, there was something wrong with the set-up - which needed to be sorted asap.

 

I did 144.000 miles in that LR with BFG KO tyres ... had to change the fronts at 83,000 miles and the rears at 102,000. Not bad for a "no rotation" policy :glasses:

 

Just my 5p's worth.

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Echoing (mostly) what Hugo said ... go for the BFG KO2 - it is available in the UK in the size you want and is a fantastic "AT hybrid" tyre ... cross between AT and MT ... but with a compound that means it functions really well as a daily driver. Highly recommended :great:

 

As to "tyre rotation" - I understand all the points you (and many others) have made about the commonsense of getting the most even use out of your 5 tyres - however, when I had a Defender90 for 10 years, I never rotated once.

An "old hand" at the garage I used for servicing explained that tyres get used to doing a particular job - the fronts turn, the rears do not AND the spare is there "just incase". He also said if I was getting uneven wear, there was something wrong with the set-up - which needed to be sorted asap.

 

I did 144.000 miles in that LR with BFG KO tyres ... had to change the fronts at 83,000 miles and the rears at 102,000. Not bad for a "no rotation" policy :glasses:

 

Just my 5p's worth.

 

I am with you on this one, Kerry!

 

My JK has 74K and 1 rotation on the original KM's, that excluded the spare.  Still going strong... those tyres are hard to kill!

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On your side note:

 

I always used to put a smear of copper grease on my nuts/studs, but have recently learned that one should not do this as it screws up your torque setting, particularly an issue on alloys wheels. Now I just make sure they are wire brushed clean each time. I actually take the time now to undo every nut clean it up as routine maintenance, so I know they will come off ok when it comes to having to do it in the rain, in the dark, at the side of the road.

 

I do have a set of locking nuts on one of my two XJs, given what I have said above, they should come off reasonably well. I'm not a great fan of them as I am especially prone to losing the socket and as I only have relatively cheap steel wheels, I'm happy without them most of the time. Mind you, a set of 235/75 15 BF KO2s ain't cheap!

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On your side note:

 

I always used to put a smear of copper grease on my nuts/studs, but have recently learned that one should not do this as it screws up your torque setting, particularly an issue on alloys wheels. Now I just make sure they are wire brushed clean each time. I actually take the time now to undo every nut clean it up as routine maintenance, so I know they will come off ok when it comes to having to do it in the rain, in the dark, at the side of the road.

 

I do have a set of locking nuts on one of my two XJs, given what I have said above, they should come off reasonably well. I'm not a great fan of them as I am especially prone to losing the socket and as I only have relatively cheap steel wheels, I'm happy without them most of the time. Mind you, a set of 235/75 15 BF KO2s ain't cheap!

 

Agree Copper grease is bad news on Lug nuts also the studs!! I would recommend regular checks anyway and re torque the lug nuts after heavy wheeling! The forces exerted in the more extreme conditions will enable some loosening off!

 

The KO2's I have recently been impressed by while driving on the sand dunes in Florence Oregon !! Instead of digging in as the muds did they allowed for the jeeps traction system to also kick in more readily.

 

 

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On service Horsham Jeep always rotate the tyres!

 

Out of curiosity Stewart - do you know if they rotate all 5 or just the 4 on the axles?

 

If they do all 5 ... it would be interesting to know what system they use?

This would probably answer the original question posted by Kelvin .... but also possibly open a can o' worms re the "realignment/tracking check" part of the question.

 

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.....ahhh...tyres, everyone's favourite topic  :icon_e_biggrin:

 

I'm running the factory Goodyear Wranglers. They've done 40,000 miles and all 5 are included in the rotation every 7,500 miles on the dealer service. I ask them to make sure they include the spare on the rotation. One time they did suggest that they would charge extra for this but I pointed out that the service description in the handbook says the spare is included. I'm not 100% what the pattern they use is but from what I can tell it appears to be circular, not a cross, or offset cross which I would use.

 

I would definitely agree with Neal on the getting the max use out of the tyres, I don't want to be left with one unused Goodyear when I have to replace the other 4. Only trouble is that so far they have hardly worn at all so my excuse for replacing them with some KO2's looks like being a long way off yet  :icon_e_sad:

 

So far no uneven wear and they've never been realigned or rebalanced after rotation.

 

The comment about tyres 'getting used to doing one thing' seems a bit unlikely to me but in any case would seem a good reason for rotating them on a regular basis. I do agree that uneven wear , particularly across one tyre is a bad sign and you should get it looked at.

 

Never used copper grease on the lugs but regularly checking the torque is a good idea (105ftlb) ....... we should all do it ,...... one of those next time jobs though  :icon_rolleyes: 

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ooo.

 

do they do as a part of the service?  Do you have to request?

 

I always "remind" them that they should do it as part of the service, and to include the spare.

I do check just to make sure but they seem pretty good and do it without complaint ( apart from one time suggesting I should pay extra for it, I think that was a new girl on reception though )

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Out of curiosity Stewart - do you know if they rotate all 5 or just the 4 on the axles?

 

If they do all 5 ... it would be interesting to know what system they use?

This would probably answer the original question posted by Kelvin .... but also possibly open a can o' worms re the "realignment/tracking check" part of the question.

Is there a 'standard' direction of rotation? I'm just thinking that if one garage rotated them e.g. so the spare goes to the left rear and the right rear goes to be the spare and then another garage went the other way, then the spare would be back where it started at last rotation  :icon_eek:

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  • 1 month later...
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kevinfourlegs

If I remember, the rotation of all five tyres is:

 

Front left to spare

 

Spare to rear left

 

Rear left to front right

 

Front right to rear right

 

Rear right to front left

 

If I got it wrong, please feel free to correct me.

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  • 2 months later...
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I know I'm digging up a dead thread, but I just wanted to ask some advice - I had my jk in for a service a while ago now, and although they did do a tyre rotation for me, they said that I shouldn't do a 5 tyre rotation as the few mm difference in tread on either side will cause problems in the diff.

I've not seen this mentioned anywhere before, so I didn't think about asking what they meant by that, and its been puzzling me ever since. Isn't that what a diff is supposed to do, cope with different rotation speeds? Doesn't this make having a full size spare a bit pointless if you can't put it on when you get a puncture?

 

If anyone could shed any light on this I'll get onto putting the 5th tyre into the rotation, as I'm only 6-7k miles into this set.

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Sounds like they're talking nonsense... but if the alignment is wrong, or a wheel isn't balanced properly, there may be an issue. Though it's too early on my newby (just 800 miles) I rotate all 5 every 5k ... you'll easily see whether they're wearing evenly across the tread.

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I know I'm digging up a dead thread, but I just wanted to ask some advice - I had my jk in for a service a while ago now, and although they did do a tyre rotation for me, they said that I shouldn't do a 5 tyre rotation as the few mm difference in tread on either side will cause problems in the diff.

I've not seen this mentioned anywhere before, so I didn't think about asking what they meant by that, and its been puzzling me ever since. Isn't that what a diff is supposed to do, cope with different rotation speeds? Doesn't this make having a full size spare a bit pointless if you can't put it on when you get a puncture?

 

If anyone could shed any light on this I'll get onto putting the 5th tyre into the rotation, as I'm only 6-7k miles into this set.

 

Agree with Patrick, sounds like cow poo to me Harry, just an excuse from a dealer who is too lazy or cheapskate to do it! In any case the whole point of a 5 tyre rotation is to even out the wear so if it's done on a regular basis then the amount of tread difference should be negligible. Having said that, it is a good idea to keep the wheels/tyres on each axle as equal as possible so, for example, if you had two tyres with 2mm tread on the front and you had to replace one because it blew then it's probably a good idea to replace both, but that's not just because of 10mm or so difference in tread ( and therefore 20mm diameter ) it's because you need new tyres!!  :icon_eek:   

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